Baron Ludwig von Hendriks and Bargle in Ravenloft?

[tomokaicho]

Has Baron Ludwig von Hendriks and/or Bargle been placed in Ravenloft by any netbook canon? The baron's storyline in Mystara more or less came to an end, and being 'rescued' by the mists just after being captured would have been a pretty cool way to introduce him into the Ravenloft setting.

Anyone have any info about this or care to speculate?

[Speedwagon]

I suppose it'd be nice to have more Mystaran Darklords and Domains other than Nebligtode (granted, Meredoth has grown on me a lot thanks to the Nocturnal Sea Gazetteer). Given that Ludwig von Hendriks benefited from Stefan's long shadow in Karameikos (and how Karameikos is basically an analogue for Eastern Europe from what I've read of it and from what it's registered as on the Fantasy Counterpart Culture page on TvTropes for Tabletop RPGS), I'd actually suggest to give him a Domain near Falkovnia. Ludwig von Hendriks is rumored to be connected to slavers or mercenary bands, so he'd be another Darklord like Drakov or NPC like Malocchio willing to shake things up militarily speaking. You could also put him somewhere on the Nocturnal Sea, so that the two Mystaran Darklords may have heard of one another (even if Meredoth isn't going to really care). I suppose Ludwig von Hendriks would be given a Domain reminiscent to the Black Eagle Barony he ruled over, but perverted in such a manner that he doesn't fully enjoy his rulership? And Bargle would make for a good NPC to get Mist-led into Ravenloft, and then figure out that Ludwig von Hendriks is here. Whether Bargle decides to go back to Ludwig's side and stay loyal, or kill Ludwig, or Bargle accumulates one too many failed powers checks and he becomes a Darklord in an Island of Terror (with trade to and from the Core and other Clusters), idk.

[tomokaicho]

Here are a couple of posts (one and two) about Ludwig von Hendriks and how this character was altered over time. In the earliest material, the baron did actually perform valuable services to the state by repelling invaders. That would make von Hendriks a marcher lord. Perhaps von Hendriks has a bit of a more complex backstory than that given in the Karameikos Gazetteer, or in the fanon material that paints von Hendriks as an ethnic chauvinist n*zi.

[The Lesser Evil]

I'm not terribly familiar with Baron Ludwig, but from what I can gleam of him from looking online is that his main themes harder to find elsewhere in Ravenloft is that he plays up the role of a subservient, upstanding, and loyal vassal to his Good lord while secretly being oppressive and conniving. So it would be that dynamic that I might want to keep, which means fabricating a relationship to a more powerful master/liege. The difficulty here is that so many regimes in Ravenloft are more openly corrupt or brutal and a few times even proud of it (Borca or Falkovnia for example). The Core itself is also pretty cramped such that inserting a barony might make for a notable power shift, and certainly you'd need to have a reason for him as an outlander to become trusted enough by the existing powers that be. You could possibly put him in Darkon or perhaps the House of Sages in Richemulot. He might also fit in with the minor barons and bickering demilords of Liffe.

Alternatively, if you wanted to place Baron Ludwig in his own domain, I wouldn't necessarily make him the leader of all of the domain but instead in a subordinate position. He might be gifted with a place of great power in the domain and can keep his corruption secret. However, he has to go through lots of rigmarole to keep his position such that it's a torment.

Bargle's a little harder for me to make him fit in. It's hard for me to put into words, but for me it's like he fits the setting yet he doesn't necessarily match the exact feel. It's not that he doesn't make for a good antagonist who's evil enough for Ravenloft. And he's good at inspiring hate. But there's something a little intangible about him that makes him evoke feelings of generic fantasy/D&D that somehow makes him feel a little out of place in Ravenloft (while at the same time making him feel evil enough for the setting). Maybe b/c he's so iconic as old school styled ornery, vile, and evil wizard? I don't know.

[tomokaicho]

Bargle's a little harder for me to make him fit in. It's hard for me to put into word

Google: Bargle killed Aleena and see if you still feel the same.

[alhoon]

Well, Bargle killed Alleena in honest combat. As far as we're talking about the basic D&D set that is, which is the only place I have seen Bargle.
Is Ludwig von Hendrik the black hawk / falcon "generic evil dude" from Karameikos?

Neither of them feel very darklord material. Sure, they are evil, but run of the mill IMO. Nothing special. A bad wizard and a bad lord.

[Lord_Pruitt]

Bargle's a little harder for me to make him fit in. It's hard for me to put into word

Google: Bargle killed Aleena and see if you still feel the same.

I was there when that happened! The Red Book in hand! Took me til I became a DM to appreciate him

I just don't think either fit the darklord mold enough to place them there. Although they could be good bad guys, trying to get out of Ravenloft, for the PCs to fight.

[tomokaicho]

I just don't think either fit the darklord mold enough to place them there. Although they could be good bad guys, trying to get out of Ravenloft, for the PCs to fight.

Right. Its unlikely that the DPs would be very interested in making von Hendriks a darklord right away. Denied his barony and wealth, however, who knows what he and Bargle would do?

In terms of the Baron's history, I prefer the very first version of Hendriks to the Gaz version, and definitely don't like the fanon version from Threshold magazine, which turns von Hendriks into a very thinly disguised stand-in for n*zis.

One thing is that victims can be perpetrators, if they handle their situation badly. I think a more interesting way to deal with von Hendriks is to give him the same resentment as that of Stannis Baratheon from Game of Thrones. That is, von Hendriks did much of the fighting for his cousin Stefan (the Archduke) during the takeover and does not feel sufficiently rewarded for his efforts. Thus, the origin of the grudge von Hendriks holds against Stefan.

[Homebrew] Instead of the rich and easy lands in the developed parts of the country, von Hendriks was granted a marchland with contested borders, and large parts of his official barony (granted by Stefan) in the hands of humanoids or even halfings from the Five Shires. On official maps, the Black Eagle Barony is a rich prize. However, large parts of the barony are under the control of goblinoids and orcs, and almost half the official barony is within the borders of the Five Shires and they obviously do not recognize the claim. The baron complained about this state of affairs to his cousin the Archduke, but instead of the Archduke sending in his armies to enforce the claim, the Archduke offered a plan of tax relief, something that any marchland is entitled to anyway. This enraged von Hendriks.

Then Bargle enters the picture, helping the cash strapped Baron von Hendriks grow his treasury through the proceeds of crime, and recruit the goblinoids and orcs that the baron was previously fighting. It is during this period that von Hendriks developed his sinister reputation.

All of this makes the barons capture by the halflings of the Five Shires all the more galling to him. Baron von Hendriks enters Ravenloft after leading a force of goblinoids and orcs from the Broken Lands back to Halag, where he orders a massacre of the new baron and his family in revenge. After this act, the mists claim von Hendriks and he emerges in a domain linked to Mystara (probably Graben).

[DustBunny]

Well, Bargle killed Alleena in honest combat. As far as we're talking about the basic D&D set that is, which is the only place I have seen Bargle.

You can get a timeline of Bargle in the official stuff here.

Neither of them feel very darklord material. Sure, they are evil, but run of the mill IMO. Nothing special. A bad wizard and a bad lord.

The Baron is definetly a 'no' in my opinion. In the BECMI boxes he was pretty much the 'Generic Evil Lord for heroic adventurers to thwart'. While he did grow in personality a bit as Mystara developed there was nothing that said 'Darklord material', and his story (mostly) ended when the Five Shires captured him.

Bargle has a bit more potential. He betrayed Hendriks and ran off. Later he showed up as an aide of King Xanthus of Blackrock. Xanthus was overthrown, but when the palace was searched King Xanthus and Bargle had vanished. Into the mists maybe?

Still there seem to be a few too many super powered wizard types running around RL, and tossing in another without a good reason slides you ever more into 'high fantasy' Ravenloft.

[alhoon]

Thank you!
I didn't know Bargle's story. I am not deep in any lore, except Ravenloft and even there I cannot compare to some of the buffs here.

I agree on Hendrik and I also agree that Bargle is "yet another powerful mage". It's not just that he's not Darklord material. Not everyone has to be darklord material to be pulled in Raveloft; not everyone has to be a darklord. It is that he is in my opinion, yet another mage.

And hilariously overpowered. Bargle having strength 9 in the basic?! And dex 17? Lol. Not to mention that making him a supermage is meh. I prefered him as mid-tier, level 5-7 mage.