4e Ravenloft Conversion Thread

[tec-goblin]

The more you look into 4E, the more you come to understand that coming up with something brand new without similarity to anything already in 4E is a difficult feat.

I can sign that! For the 7thSea we started thinking of a swashbuckler class, a hereditary sorcerer class and a nobleman class. We saw that the latter was practically unfeasible under 4e design ideals, the second could be done with just some new ritual casting feats and rituals and the first was covered 80% by the rogue class, so we did the job with just a few added feats, rituals and powers.

*Independence: Your work should stand alone. Try not to make extensive references to any other works you have done. Each work should be as modular and self-contained as possible. This makes it easy for people to take what they like from your works, and abandon or change that which they don't.

That's true, but integration is nice to have too. I agree that 3e Ravenloft had way too many added rules, but the fact that every prestige class or monster tried to reinvent them did not help at all.
There were monsters with a fear aura etc that did NOT cause fear or terror checks, NOR the standard shaken etc conditions, but something different altogether. Yes it was modular, but it killed the purpose of the rules for fear and horror altogether.

[DocBeard]

Couldn't bloodline traits just be feats?

[Jester of the FoS]

Which does mean that they'd be losing their bonus feat.

For bloodlines I'd actually replace the human bonus At-will ability with some unique bloodline-related Encounter power.

[Hell_Born]

That makes a lot of sense, and it's quite thematically appropriate. Now, my memory isn't so hot, but can't Calibans, Half-Elves and Half-Vistani also belong to a bloodline? If so, how would they gain their bloodline power? ...then again, would they even gain it in the first place? Maybe only pure-blooded humans of a Ravenloft bloodline can have powers- Calibans and Halfs are too "impure" in their blood to have it influence them...

[Jester of the FoS]

All three also gain an encounter power so, with DM's permission, it could be just swapped out.

[Nikolas of the Mists]

Which does mean that they'd be losing their bonus feat.

For bloodlines I'd actually replace the human bonus At-will ability with some unique bloodline-related Encounter power.

Nah I would still use feats. You want it, you pay for it.
I personally don't want 50 million variations on "Human" flying around.
What I don't mind is a baseline human with a feat they bought reflecting lineage.
I'd keep it simple and keep it a feat.

As a human you get that bonus feat at first level, so you'd just be using that bonus feat to pick up the bloodline feat.

[Jester of the FoS]

Both ways go against the design goals of humans really. They're meant to be flexible and diverse having their choice of power, skill, and feat.
Forcing them to pick a particular one is awkward at best.

A choice of feats might be the best way.

[Nikolas of the Mists]

If you were to make bloodline abilities feats in 4E, taking them would represent more than just blood relation -- it would reflect an individual who is similar in nature to the founder. It's like your mom saying that you have your great grandfather's personality, or your dad saying that you get your artistic skill from your mother's side of the family.

Anyone could be a descended from a bloodline, but not all descendents are like their founder or representative of their family traits.

Keep in mind that even back in 3/3.5 you weren't granted the feats for free - you were simply given the ability to purchase them, so having them remain as feats in 4E isn't so far a stretch.

[tec-goblin]

For bloodlines I'd actually replace the human bonus At-will ability with some unique bloodline-related Encounter power.

I see that bloodline feats are the choice that lets people combine multiple bloodlines (well, we could limit someone to two bloodlines) and plays best with the 4e ideals, but I still think that the bonus at-will ability is lame (and as a player I would love to have it replaced by a feat )

[Nikolas of the Mists]

That makes a lot of sense, and it's quite thematically appropriate. Now, my memory isn't so hot, but can't Calibans, Half-Elves and Half-Vistani also belong to a bloodline? If so, how would they gain their bloodline power? ...then again, would they even gain it in the first place? Maybe only pure-blooded humans of a Ravenloft bloodline can have powers- Calibans and Halfs are too "impure" in their blood to have it influence them...

Most bloodlines from Legacy of Blood were really restricted in terms of Blood purity. Demihumans in most Ravenloft bloodlines were really rare, largely because aristocracy and nobility doesn't lend itself to illegitimitate children in a soeciety fill with xenophobia and fear of the different. If a demihuman wanted to take a bloodline, I would probably make it so they had to use their single lv1 feat to get access to the bloodline lineage.

[DocBeard]

If you were to make bloodline abilities feats in 4E, taking them would represent more than just blood relation -- it would reflect an individual who is similar in nature to the founder. It's like your mom saying that you have your great grandfather's personality, or your dad saying that you get your artistic skill from your mother's side of the family.

Wouldn't that be more appropriate? If you are bound closely enough to the family, then you might look like ol'Strahd or have the Borsti chuckle or whatever features the famlies consider prominant.

It's no more "Auto-Evil" than being an infernal warlock; it could mean you're a villain, but it could also just mean you're tied to a bad power outlet.

[Nikolas of the Mists]

yeap, I have pondered a few options for bloodlines, but really only have a very rough outline of what I am considering so far.

something like this


Bloodline Mechanics:
In order to be considered a member of a bloodline you must meet two requirements:

a) Possess prerequisites from two or more different “Favored Assets”.
-Attributes listed under Favored Assets must be 14 or higher to count.
-Skills listed under Favored Assets must be trained to count.
-Feats listed under Favored Assets that must be selected in order to count.

b) Select at least one bloodline feat specific to your lineage at character creation. Note that you cannot select bloodline feats without first meeting the prerequisites of your line’s “Favored Assets”.

The Boritsi Bloodline

Favored Assets:
Attributes: Wisdom or Charisma
Skills: Diplomacy or Perception
Feats: Human Perseverance or Linguist

Bloodline Legacy: Upon selecting a Boritsi bloodline feat, you gain access to the following bloodline legacy – Boritsi Vitality.

Boritsi Vitality: Like a fine wine, you improve with age. You add twenty years onto your projected life expectancy, and your beauty, wit and charm will never fade.

Bloodline Feats: Poison Resistance, somethingelseIhaventworkedout, somethingelse again.

Poison Resistance: you gain a +2 bonus to your fortitude defense against poison attacks, and a +2 bonus to save when attempting to shake the effects of poison in your body.

===

Again as you can see it is a *very* rough idea of what I am planning, it's not worded well in terms of mechanics, and doesn't have any flavour text at all, but oh well.

Basically you meet the requirements for the lineage, buy one of their bloodline feats at level 1, and get access to a minor ability I have referred to as a bloodline legacy. After level 1 you spend feats and things as normal, and also have the option of purchasing other bloodline specific feats later on.

[DocBeard]

Hrm.

Oh, by the way, I changed my mind on the firearms thing, I think that the 'use two minor actions' is a great idea. It creates that sense of a line of musketeers standing and shooting, without making a process that took someone who used a powder rifle regularly a few seconds artificially long. And you can duck for cover to reload, plus it gives Rogues and Rangers, with their movement powers, a nice little boost when using that sort of ranged weapon.

So yeah, I think that's a really solid compromise, and it's how I'll be working firearms into my game when I unleash them on my unsuspecting PCs next session. "It's a goblin." "...with a gun!"

[Nikolas of the Mists]

My Firearms rules

http://www.box.net/shared/0dpwi7meck

[Lord Soth]

Anyone done a conversion of Alanik Ray, yet? Cause if not...

ALANIK RAY
Eladrin Rogue 10
STR: 8 [-1], CON: 10 [+0], DEX: 18 [+4], INT: 19 [+4], WIS: 17 [+3], CHA: 13 [+1]
DEFENSES - AC: 23, FORT: 17, REF: 23, WILL: 21
INITIATIVE: +9, SPEED (SQUARES): +6
HIT POINTS: 67, BLOODIED: 33, HEALING SURGE: 16, SURGES PER DAY: 6

RACIAL FEATURES: Low-Light Vision, Eladrin Education, Eladrin Weapon Proficiency, Eladrin Will, Fey Origin, Trance, Fey Step
CLASS FEATURES: First Strike, Rogue Tactics (Artful Dodger), Rogue Weapon Talent, Sneak Attack

LANGUAGES: Darkonese, Elven, Falkovnian, Lamordian, Mordentish
SKILLS: Arcana +13, Diplomacy +8, Dungeoneering +10, Endurance +7, Heal +10, History +13, Intimidate +8, Nature +10, Religion +11
TRAINED SKILLS: Acrobatics +14, Athletics +11, Bluff +11, Insight +18, Perception +18, Stealth +16, Streetwise +11, Thievery +14
FEATS: Backstabber, Jack of All Trades, Linguist, Skill Focus (Insight), Skill Focus (Perception), Skill Training (Acrobatics)
EQUIPMENT: Goldenfang (+3 Magic Dagger), +2 Sylvan Leather Armor, Diadem of Acuity, +2 Amulet of Health, pistol, bullets (20), silvered bullets (20), flasks (6), thieves' tools, several ritual scrolls

AT-WILL POWERS: Deft Strike, Piercing Strike
ENCOUNTER POWERS: Fey Step, Dazing Strike (1st), Setup Strike (3rd), Sand in the Eyes (7th)
DAILY POWERS: Easy Target (1st), Clever Riposte (5th), Knockout (9th)
UTILITY POWERS: Fleeting Ghost (2nd), Chameleon (6th), Shadow Stride (10th)

Couple explanations:

1) He's a 10th-level Thief, so I figured I'd make him a 10th-level Rogue. Simple enough. As for why Eladrin, it's the more "refined" elf race, which suits him better then the more woodsy Elf. Fey Step is new for him, but hey, it'd certainly help in his investigations, now wouldn't it?

2) I took his stats from Champions of the Mists and adjusted them appropriately. His stats there are STR 8, CON 9, DEX 17, INT 17, WIS 17, CHA 13. I took away the Con penalty, putting it up to 10, and subtracted the Dex bonus, reducing it to a 16. Then I added in the +2 Dex and +2 Int bonus. I assumed the stat bonuses for levelling up were already built in.

3) Artful Dodger was a given, seeing as how his Strength score was mediocre. Besides, he doesn't strike me as a 'Brutal Scoundrel'. IMO, if he gets into a fight, he's more about making sure he's not hurt then he is about bludgeoning the other guy into little bits.

4) His skills were, for the most part, pretty much a given, too. He has Pick Pockets, Open Locks, Find/Remove Traps, Move Silently, Hide in Shadows, Detect Noise, Climb Walls, and Read Languages. So at the very least that calls for Thievery, Stealth, Perception, and Athletics. Insight and Streetwise are also musthaves for a good detective. That ate up the six Rogue skills right there. I used the bonus skill for being an Eladrin to give him Bluff. Last but not least, Skill Training to get him Acrobatics.

5) When it came to his Feats, originally I'd given him numerous Skill Training Feats, including Arcana, History and Religion. But then I remembered Jack of All Trades and went with that instead. Between his Int and Wis bonuses, most every skill he has is nearly as good as if he were trained with them. Skill Focus (Insight) and (Perception) also means that pretty much nothings gets by him. Pretty good for "the Great Detective".

I considered giving him Ritual Caster, as in 2E he had the ability to use scrolls, but nah. You don't need that to use ritual scrolls. And besides, he would've needed to get Skill Training (Arcana) to get Ritual Caster. And what would've been the point? He definitely makes use of rituals whenver appropriate, but he's not the type who carries around a ritual book with him, nor does he have extensive training in magic that having the Skill Training (Arcana) or Ritual Caster Feats would've entailed (despite having a pretty high bonus in Arcana, there's some knowledge that's still beyond his grasp. So he'll have to consult with an expert on occasion).

I gave him Linguist as he needed to know at least one other language (He would've started with Darkonese and Elven, but after moving to Dementlieu, he would've had to pick up Lamordian at least. Besides, he's the type who I'd expect to speak several languages). Last but not least, I gave him Backstabber, my one nod to combat effectiveness with his Feats. Between his fondness for Goldenfang, and his desire to end any fights he gets into quickly and efficiently, it looked like a sensible option for him.

6) When it came to his powers. His Utility Powers were pretty easy. I went with the ones which would be of most use to him during investigations. Namely Fleeting Ghost, Chameleon, and Shadow Stride, which're great for when you want to observe a target without them knowing you're there. Those three will be of great use to him whenever he's tailing someone or he's sneaking into someones home or lair looking for evidence.

As for the others, I went for choices which I thought would make sense for someone who's trying to avoid fights whenever possible. Or when he does get into them, to end them as quickly as possible. Knockout's a good one. Easy Target slows the target, giving Alanik a chance to make a quick getaway. Same for Dazing Strike and Sand in the Eyes. The man doesn't seem above fighting dirty to me.

7) Last but not least, his magic items. He had a +4 dagger, but I made it +3 (it does an extra 3d6 damage on a critical, so not much of a loss. I also tried to stick to the rules for creating higher-level PC's. I.E. a 10th-level character would get an 11th-level item, a 10th-level item, and a 9th-level item, along with gold equal to the value of a 9th-level item. And a +3 Magic Dagger is an 11th-level item. Everything else is below level, though. I figure if one wanted to, they could take the excess gold and buy him a pretty decent library of ritual scrolls.

The Diadem of Acuity he's carrying are replacements for the Eyes of Minute Seeing that Champions of the Mists says he's supposed to have. Besides, of course he'd have that, what with the bonus to Insight and Perception. As for the last two items, they're concessions to making him a viable 10th-level character (who should have a +2 bonus to AC, Fort, Ref, and Will). They're items that Alanik would carry, though, as they're useful to his investigations. Sylvan Armor giving him a bonus to Athletics and Stealth, while Amulet of Health protects him against poison.

And that's pretty much all I got for now. Appreciate any thoughts. Thanks.