Children of the Night: Giants

[Speedwagon]

A little late but just a few ideas I have used for giants in Ravenloft games I ran.

Perspective
A mist giant I ran when looked at by anyone as long as they were at a far enough distance looked to be the size of a person but when they started moving toward a target suddenly the view readjusts and the giant is the size it should be but by then it is close enough to be a threat. Once the giant got away this illusion like distortion resumed so next time it was at a distance they looked to be human sized. This often triggered a fear save to perhaps a horror save depending upon how it occurred.

Size Changing
A giant serial killer who stalked Dementlieu and using a size changing ring appeared human sized and raided farms and other areas near the city or ate people only to shrink after and hide away as a Caliban laborer.

Camouflage
A forest giant who used tree covered hills of a region of forested terrain stalked the roads while wearing a grass and tree covered cloak to hide by laying down and resting. They had high levels of survival and stealth and threw dirt and rocks and such to strike out but then hid as part of the terrain and attempted to move with less sign of damage to be harder to track. It also favored striking at night or quick grabs and dashes away during misted days but could attack in the day but likely to lone wagons or targets rather than mass groups.

These are some lovely (and scary) ideas! Thanks for sharing them! How did the PCs you had manage to deal with these giants?

[A G Thing]

Well they happened in various games and some more successfully than others...

Perspective Mist Giant

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Nova Vaasa with a town I invented was where the perspective fooling mist giant adventure took place. The illusion was visual and sound based but there was a flaw in that it required a certain distance be maintained to keep the illusion until it approached. Too close and the illusion ends so it would move up to this limit close and then spring what seemed an incredible distance to attack. The group thought it was teleporting and maybe just growing or something rapidly but after looking at the tracks afterwards and comparing their experiences they reasoned their senses were being fooled. The trail just before the charge always started at almost exactly the same distance away. Understanding this they set traps over distances and also used ranged attacks with a marker system to denote where the giants form actually was at a distance. This let them turn one of its ambushes against it and negated the miss chance they had previously when the misjudged the size and distance. This worked okay but it still had mist powers and ambush tactics but since it was hunting the town out of personal grudge it wanted to kill out of vengeance and so it did not flee. It appeared and tried to drive the people and PC's out with fear while killing them one at a time often carrying a single victim off. It stomped the party mage dead and did try to carry off the fighter but the barbarian weakened it and the traps as well as the rogue got a final hit. The giant vanished into the mists after being slain and the true culprit a vengeful drunk poor elder of the village died as his curse of vengeance was undone since his farm and family name were destroyed by the towns treachery and greed. People pointed towards a witch in the nearby forest who they blamed and while she was creepy she claimed that she was not the one who brought down the giant on the village. She did say that the people of the village did not respect the lands bounty nor each other and because of their greed and evil something seemed to have festered within. The people had turned upon each other to take land and expand by removing the corrupt successful families above them and then forcing their claims through using bribes and deals made with noble lord to make it so. Power and wealth shifted seemingly overnight and the victimizer's became victims and the old victims became the new victimizer's. The families that once profitted were now under the thumb of those they abused and the lord and his family profited. Nobody suspected the poor elder much more than most simply due to the fact that others also had grudges against the town and he was often drunk ranting for their losses and some families were forced to leave or also became too poor to do so and losing all of their farmlands. The party actually suspected the son of the most successful noble family who was against his families profiting more due to it hurting his friends family and his sense of justice. His friends family the ones who were hurt as well were prominently noteworthy before and they seemingly had not been attacked. The PC's actually missed learning much about the old elder before his death simply discounting the poor drunken elder and his family which had they asked more about they would have learned they had been before then seemingly unnaturally successful and most people just brushed off his failing as a sort of deserved punishment for he and his as they had been profiting off of others first. Their success was due to them seeming to have the favor of this mist entity for some reason. He was no mage or such but he still in passion was met by this being of the mists who listened and he then in a fit of rage cursed the thriving town and sealed it with his first murder and let his hate devour him. In the end the town survived but the families within were left facing that doing unto their abusers what had been done to them just led to this evil and the crime that led to their wealth was exposed to the lord of the land who put someone new over the region. The town was put under the thumb of Othmar and the Nova Vaasan government and nobility and people now would pay far more and be restricted.

Size Changing Caliban Giant

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With size changing Caliban giant I had it be a murder mystery but since the killer was doing so to feed but to avoid being caught it would strike at lone targets and left signs of massive damage or such but there were more humanoid foot prints at the scenes than missing victims. Eventually the party figured out that the killer was traveling over certain spans as a giant and yet others were traveled as a medium humanoid. They also learned stories and reports that other areas in the domain each season had similar problems but never the same region twice it would seem. This led them to investigate the laborers who came out of the city to work and eventually note that the attacks happened when a certain group of them would be working in the fields or farms. A few traits in common between the workers such as indentured work contracts and records as criminals to a degree put a few kinks in the trail and a rather gluttonous work boss who tended to be greedy and cruel managed their services to the farms along with such made it a bit of work to rule out. The work boss didn't know or care and kept throwing the trail towards other laborers and even to bandits or such. The trails on these led farther away and nothing suggested the other groups or bandits in the area could get to that region in the time the events happened. One of their suspects vanished seemingly with a horse leaving trophy items from the crimes as if they fled in a hurry and yet they saw through the ruse as the suspect was disposed of by the giant to make them hunt for them. This instead made them focus in on the right work crew due to it being suspicious. In the end the final detail that led to them finding the giant was that while the farms and travelers being attacked were lone they all were within a few hours of the places the single remaining suspect work crew stayed those nights and also that the trails seemed to lead there so the staked out the crew and caught the culprit who transformed to attack his boss and the crew. The Caliban Giant had been hired just this season along with others but also tended to sleep alone due to the prejudice of the others on the crew and the farms they worked on. Other suspects were the Boss who slept alone in his own quarters in the camp, the bosses assistant who abused his position and was the one that the giant tried to frame, the largest guy on the work crew who always seemed to be hungry and violent and what seemed to be the wagon driver who headed off for the night each night to as it turns out gamble.The PC's solved the issue for the Port a' Lucine merchants and got their reward with only a few NPC deaths.

Camouflage Giant

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The Camouflage giant was an ambush attacker but their methods struck at the roads between Vor Ziyden in Borca and a village to the north to claim wagons and victims and leave no survivors if possible. The PC's at first actually ignored Vor Ziyden and thus this hook telling about dangers on the trail and so they took that road and headed off ignorant of the danger as the guards not being the best or concerned about them did not care to inform them. They took the road and the first pass they avoided encountering the giant simply due to their speed as in that game they had one of the first steam car vehicles to travel with. On the way back from their trip coming back upon the same road they stumbled upon the attack results of the giant against a wagon two miners were going to mine with. They saw some of the resulting gore and rubble left behind and the trail but did not want to risk chase. They went back to town and reported the sight and the guards added it to the pile with little intent to go out and die on that road. The party spent some time researching it and found out about previous attacks and also the lack of survivors. They narrowed the region down on a map and began to hunt the giant using dogs and some brave souls including a hunter who knew the area. They eventually found scraps of meals and such taken from victims and noted along the road a few sites of interest where the ground had been dug up or disturbed and also trees had been displaced. When the group found a place that confused the dogs and hunter they noticed that the plants were mostly dying on this odd hill that didn't fit the landscape. When the dogs began to start to freak out the giant attacked and attempted to fight then flee. The group didn't catch or kill the giant and it fled that time but knowing more about it they began to hunt it and yet it had gone to a ravine cave lair and hid and struck in confined spaces. The party flooded the large caves with smoke rather than keep going in and pushing it outside they used methods such as a net and tripping it to kill it in a more open area. The guards however, followed in behind them and claimed the spoils giving them only minor pay using the backing of the local crime lord who had a title to support them doing so unless they risked creating an incident. They were given credit as heroes but not much else and the measly 100 gp reward didn't even cover their expenses. Luckily the rogue decided to rob the noble lord before they left town completely and they took over 5,000 gp worth of valuables and a magic ring from there in the night though it was risky as well.

[alhoon]

I am actually making a domain now, more on the fantasy side than the gothic horror side, and I have cloud giants in a corner of the domain. Evil ones, that have their own rules. They are not exactly bullies but their morality is different than that of humans and they would be considered immoral even if not alien. It is, in a way, racism as they view the much smaller, less smart, shorter-lived humans as way beneath them.
THOSE giants are in effect a dark mirror of what the powerful warriors can be:
A 9th lvl warrior-type character will probably be smarter than many, stronger than most and can put down singlehandedly the baron's personal guard. Does that make him worth more than the average soldier? In salary sure, but is he worth more as a person? Should being able to get away with punching the baron in the face if the baron 'misbehaves' be a reason to do it? Who gets to decide? Laws? Or the guy that can follow his own morals with little fear of immediate repercussions?
Well, the morals of the giants make them ignore human laws...

[IanFordam]

Well they happened in various games and some more successfully than others...

Just want to say that I appreciated these adventure summaries. Sounds like you run investigative adventures which don't rely upon a certain path of investigation, and those can be tough to pull off. I get the impression that you're either good at planning ahead of time or else good at improvisation on the spot. Thanks for sharing.

[A G Thing]

To Alhoon

That is a perfect moral that often is attributed to giants in that just because they are bigger, more powerful and more in modern DnD advanced does not mean that they can oppress others. Eberron in Xendrik shows that with their history of destroying their own culture and enslaving elves and such before their fall.

The inverse in stories is also true in that one interpretation of Jack and the Beanstalk shows beyond some issues of cannibal giants attempt to eat him upon catching him is that Jack is the villain because he shifted his responsibilities to try and get rich and then robbed and murdered a giant again to solve his problems. It frames the human not the giant as at least also a villain and instigator as he went there and robbed them just because he viewed the powerful as monsters to kill and take from to solve his own problems. It is the struggle between the advantaged and disadvantaged that giants highlight and while giants are certainly intimidating the small folk can be vicious and covetous enough to rob and murder from them.

In your example it seems that cultures that interact view the other as not true people at least from the giants side and the small folk if being eaten or exploited likely view the giants as fearfully dreadful monsters. If the giants are the cause then I guess it would depend upon what conflict is driving the giants and the smaller folk to interaction and such. If the giants are lording power than it is a more classic tale of evil giants taking what they feel the deserve but if so why? Just because they deserve it by right of power to rule or because they view themselves as protectors or shepherds or such? Are the small folk just trying to take more resources or expand and the giants are unwilling to share what they view as theirs? Are the giants harvesting the people or at least culling them as they desire on a whim or to keep them in line and repressed?

Well they happened in various games and some more successfully than others...

Just want to say that I appreciated these adventure summaries. Sounds like you run investigative adventures which don't rely upon a certain path of investigation, and those can be tough to pull off. I get the impression that you're either good at planning ahead of time or else good at improvisation on the spot. Thanks for sharing.

Thank you for the compliment and glad to share.

As for how I do those adventures, well I have to plan a bit and often I set a few points of interest to guide and a few paths are planned but I think most DM's have to have some level of improvisation skills ready because the party doesn't always do what you expect.

I tend to have a few locations like the main town/camp area, an encounter/setpiece site and maybe a main dungeon/adventure site planned before hand but not much else. You also need to know what is in the surrounding area in a vague sense so just have a domain map or make a regional map for such. If you put an NPC in the forest you can usually wing their house and some of the descriptive fluff but I think the NPC should also be planned.

For the main foe and or main minion you need to design them then just make your villain/minion have a reason for doing what they do, a plan set on how they act and behave and also have a timeline of either hours but more often at least days of how long or how many things need to happen for them to succeed and then think of the details to guide the PC's through NPC's or clues. If the timeline passes or the goal is achieved the PC's lose and the villain gets what they want. Also have a few monsters for encounters or traps but those you might improvise though having an idea that fits the theme for the villain/minon works well.

A few extra locations and interactions that they can miss or encounter as red herrings as well. Then just RP the characters and point things out casually and let the players try to decide where to go. If they don't get things going or just try to stop the villain on their next attack or such then just advance the villains plan a step and enact any consequences. In doing this the events and incident should at least narrow focus or leave a clue for the PC's to look in a direction. If they look for detail imagine some detail and maybe more clues toward the original intent of what they found but don't give them too much or you undercut the mystery.

For example if you have them find a watch and that watch was the villains then if they look at it they might notice it is either an expensive or poor watch, it could be broken on the time or around the time of the crime, there could be some type of damage done to the watch that suggests something happened that was not known such as it stopped a bullet or a claw scratched it or maybe the watch was from a previous victim not far from there they can go to and ask the family about.

Doesn't matter if they find all of the clues or plot threads or not, just if they are pointed in a direction right or wrong. Then just run it as they go down that trail. Occasionally throw in an improvised twist if they put themselves in an interesting position like a mysterious sighting on the scene or a pursuit that could give a hint if the villain/minion is watching them on how it works. Also tend to be careful with mood as if you make things too suspicious or tense at the start you basically spoon feed answers through the feeling something is off. Make the tension normal for questioning or such until they dig deeper or find something to really make them get that feeling something is off about this clue/person/place and then dig in to find the real meat.

In the end if they win or lose depends on if they are both clever and lucky in die rolls in any game. If a player notices something or makes a good roll that could reasonably interact with a clue or sign you left give them small hints if they remain lost but do not give them more than just something to make them curious. Sometimes but rarely if they are too stubborn on the wrong path start dropping rolls and hints that lead them down the seemingly wrong path until you reveal why their suspicion is wrong and they wasted time but finally cleared the suspected item/person/place as a false lead.

As a final note, if you put your villain out there to be in danger then have an escape but if the players kill the villain in some clever way then let them but I also advise that during that death make the villain seem like they are hard to kill or have some creepy thing or other intimidating aspect to the death. You basically might make it so there is the sense that the death of the villain in some way that stopped their plans before they advanced too far left them lingering with hate like a ghost haunting the players. Obviously don't make every villain the party slays early a ghost but once in a while especially if the party is disrespectful in how they kill the villain have reports come in the future of trouble in the place they thought they saved. Vengeance bringing a villain back as a ghost or to finish their goal is a good follow up and the past adventure can flavor and even inform the new one.

[alhoon]

To AlhoonIf the giants are lording power than it is a more classic tale of evil giants taking what they feel the deserve but if so why? Just because they deserve it by right of power to rule or because they view themselves as protectors or shepherds or such? Are the small folk just trying to take more resources or expand and the giants are unwilling to share what they view as theirs? Are the giants harvesting the people or at least culling them as they desire on a whim or to keep them in line and repressed?

Actually the giants are happy in their corner. They kill trespassing humans and enslave a few goliaths (which they consider closer to them) and dwarves (which they consider better stock than humans). When they want something, from more sheep to cook for the birthday meal to silk, they move out of their area, stomp into human lands and take it with little care of what happens to the people that lose their sheep or lives, or what happens to the local community when the ruling class is eliminated by 4 cloud giants that dropped in from the clouds and killed the local ladies for their silk.
The giants do employ a few humanoids they consider better than humans as infiltrators to know where to look but they are as likely to wander to a village grab 10 people and ask them to tell them where they can find silk - or else.

I.e. they have a mentality of "what's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." and "You're not allowed to step near my mountains but I will come to your town and take what I want anytime."

[Baron Von Stanton]

I.e. they have a mentality of "what's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." and "You're not allowed to step near my mountains but I will come to your town and take what I want anytime."

That is to say, they are social parasites.

[IanFordam]

I.e. they have a mentality of "what's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." and "You're not allowed to step near my mountains but I will come to your town and take what I want anytime."

That is to say, they are social parasites.

Seems pretty anti-social to me.

[alhoon]

I.e. they have a mentality of "what's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." and "You're not allowed to step near my mountains but I will come to your town and take what I want anytime."

That is to say, they are social parasites.

25 ft tall ones, with CR10-11 (I dislike that D&D next has them as CR9 so I boost them).

[Baron Von Stanton]

I.e. they have a mentality of "what's mine is mine, what's yours is mine." and "You're not allowed to step near my mountains but I will come to your town and take what I want anytime."

That is to say, they are social parasites.

Seems pretty anti-social to me.

Well, as they say, "order for the spider, chaos for the fly, if the cuckoo doesn't find her chick in her chosen host nest, she'll eat the foster parent," blah blah blah.

[KingCorn]

Another idea is the Nephilim of Judeaic myth. The supposed half human children of angels (or the children of Cain in some stories). Usually depicted as violent dull giants who ruled the earth just before the flood, monstrous half-divines well fit the gothic tone of Ravenloft. Perhaps this is a supposed origin of Giants in the Land of Mists.
A land which could have some weird-types of giants is Hazlan, thanks to its old ruins. Maybe their version of giants where the supposed fallen sons/servants of the Lawgiver.

Maybe rather than a Children of the Night, this could instead be a Van Richten's Guide (courtesy of the Weathermay-Foxgrove Twins), with multiple suggestions of giants in the Mists and some examples and rules for them. The nephilim thing could be one of their misconceptions, like how Van Richten assumed fiends are just a natural evolution of liches, since he wasn't aware of the Outer Planes.

Edit: Actually, the idea of Nephilim really does have alot of in-story ideas to support this. In Norse myth, the first giant was Ymir. In dragonlance, the giants originate from the Ogres, who were originally the beautiful and towering Irda before being cursed for their evil ways (again, seems similar to the Nephilim). So while Sithicus and maybe Falkovnia would have stories similar to the Irda, religious realms might mention something like the Nephilim, Hazlan would mention some ancient race, and Barovia would have something like the magic giant/dragon Zmeu.

[KingCorn]

Little late on this (since submissions for QtR are due tomorrow), but another potential giant: The Davana, a type of asura descended from the primordial goddess Danu and an ancient sage Kashyapa, they are said to have been exiled from the world by the devas, and have hated them ever since. They are described as giants (sometimes) and also have some form of illusion or shapeshifting ability

[Speedwagon]

Little late on this (since submissions for QtR are due tomorrow), but another potential giant: The Davana, a type of asura descended from the primordial goddess Danu and an ancient sage Kashyapa, they are said to have been exiled from the world by the devas, and have hated them ever since. They are described as giants (sometimes) and also have some form of illusion or shapeshifting ability

No worries, I'm very happy that there's still engagement with this thread and I plan to give my thoughts on the Davana and the Nephilim idea soon (well, October 1st to be specific)!

[KingCorn]

I may have found a real-life example of the Falkovnian Giant Soldiers: The Potsdam Giants, Fredrick the Great's Dad (also named Fredrick) regiment of 'giant soldiers' (a little bit over 6ft which was impressive at the time), and was over time filled with giants sent over from other monarchs such as Peter the Great and even an Ottoman Sultan, all basically as a weird diplomatic gift.
Fredrick also tried to pair these giant guys with giant gals, something which even Charles Darwin commented on in 'The Descent of Man'. When his son, The Great, took over, he downgraded the regiment cause, ya know, this whole things was kinda silly.

So there we go: A german king, whose bloodline would one day found the German Empire, had giant soldiers which he collected from other monarchs. Honestly, it makes whatever Falkovnia could cook up seem almost sensible.

[Speedwagon]

I may have found a real-life example of the Falkovnian Giant Soldiers: The Potsdam Giants, Fredrick the Great's Dad (also named Fredrick) regiment of 'giant soldiers' (a little bit over 6ft which was impressive at the time), and was over time filled with giants sent over from other monarchs such as Peter the Great and even an Ottoman Sultan, all basically as a weird diplomatic gift.
Fredrick also tried to pair these giant guys with giant gals, something which even Charles Darwin commented on in 'The Descent of Man'. When his son, The Great, took over, he downgraded the regiment cause, ya know, this whole things was kinda silly.

So there we go: A german king, whose bloodline would one day found the German Empire, had giant soldiers which he collected from other monarchs. Honestly, it makes whatever Falkovnia could cook up seem almost sensible.

Upon reading this in full, I am in full agreement. Plus I think the reason why Drakov responds well to things like Giant soldiers or the Primal Serum, is that the recipients are still ultimately human at their core, and ultimately still capable of being controlled by him. Undead are both a liability if they walk into Darkon where a necromancer or lich can hijack them (see Toben the Many's fear of going into Darkon because Azalin would claim his identity) and they probably disgust Drakov for their very nature. With the other examples, they are still fundamentally "alive" and capable of experiencing the "joys" of war like he does, among other ideas in his twisted psyche.

I would assume that Drakov, given his many statements of being a great tactical leader (despite not winning wars but that's more due to his curse, cuz if he's incompetent then he isn't cursed imo) he would maybe have only a sliver of Giant Soldiers on the front line, and instead use them as glorified artillery. While he dislikes gunpowder and magic, I think he'll be happy with living siege weapons to replace mangonels, onagers, scorpions, ballistas, and trebuchets in terms of logistics.