Café de Nuit

Something just crossed my mind the other day. If being splashed with holy water deals 2d4 damage to undead and evil outsiders, what would be the effects of getting holy water into the body, either by ingestion or injection? The way I see it, there are two different ways to look at it:

1) While you'd have a hard time injecting anything in a skeleton, creatures like vampires, ancient dead, and even corporeal ghosts could easily be victims of this, as well as ingestion (holy water ice cubes in their drinks?). Furthermore, anything which bypasses their external defenses must necessarily do more damage, as it goes straight to their internal, vital, body parts and -functions. After all, one might say, wouldn't a vial of holy water injected straight into a vampire's heart be more effective than simply soaking them in it?

2) Another argument would be that, as undead creatures, their bodies can hardly be said to have any vital areas - they're immune to critical hits, after all. Injection won't really do much good, since you can't exactly rely on blood streams to carry the holy water around. Essentially, this argument boils down to "undead have no vital body parts or -functions, and, as such, there are none to target with internal damage."

Any opinions on this particular matter?

Oh, as an afterthought, is holy water affected by damage reduction? I don't think so, but I'm not sure.

As you say, undead have no real metabolism, and thus they probably don't have any "external defenses" to bypass. I'd make injected or ingested holy water inflict standard damage. As for damage reduction, the PHB states it affects evil outsiders and undead as if it were acid. Since that is, in theory, a destructive energy attack, it is not blocked by DR.

Igor the Henchman wrote:As you say, undead have no real metabolism.

Com'on Igor! After all, Vampires can create Dhampirs!
Now seriously, I would suggest that an injection of holy water would just do maximum damage, since none of the liquid falls off the unholy body of the undead.

I subscribe to theory 2, nothing vital there even for vamps. Hearts are big but digestion is a different part of the body.
However, damage is abstract and based on the idea a vial or splash of holy water mostly hits. Some splashes off, some hits cloth and some burns. Injestion might do maximum possible damage, but needles and a glass w/ ice hold far less than a vial.

I agree. max. damage and with holy water being a weakness to nearly all undead, it bypasses damage reduction, the way garlic to a vampire bypasses its damage reduction if applied to a weapon or ingested.

alhoon wrote: Com'on Igor! After all, Vampires can create Dhampirs!

Oh, for the love of...


But yes, I think maximum damage might be a good way to settle it in case of an injection. Surely an unlikely deed like that should be worth something.

There was a Buffy episode in which she lured a mad Vampire to take his pills with holy water. He was burnt from the inside out.

A vampire taking pills? As unlikely as an undead drinking a beverage with icecubes IMO.

Buffy vamps tend to be a bit more "alive" than D&D ones. They can get drunk, for example. That particular one was nuts, and taking some sort of meds for it. It was a neat scene, even if it's not directly applicapable to RL.

Maximum damage is a good idea, but as David points out, syringes and ice cubes etc. hold far less holy water than a vial. However, a direct hit with a vial means that quite a lot of the water does not hit the target, as all objects around it are also splashed (1 point of damage, but still splashed). Thus, perhaps a direct hit from a normal-sized, holy water-filled syringe would do 6 points of damage? Does that sound reasonable? Shame that the tranquilizer gun wasn't invented until 1959 (syringes with needles thin enough to pierce skin was invented in 1853), or Masque characters would have a nice addition to their arsenal.

I would have ingested holy water inflict full damage also. As for injected holy water, I feel thgat would only inflict harm on the area is was injected to, it's damage done after the initial injection, affer which the power given to it is used up.

But yes, a very nice addition to the arsenal of characters on Gothic Earth

Don't forget that the syringe itself, being a piercing weapon of sorts, is subject to the target's DR, if any.

Well, I suppose it depends on how you inject the holy water.

I mean, Holy water injected BY COATING IT ON THE BLADE OF MY HOLY AVENGER AND SLIDING IT BETWEEN ITS BLACK UNHOLY UNDESERVING OF THE EFFORT RIBS might cause a bit more damage *ahem*

Umm... magical syringes?

Or just a magical weapon with the Viperbite modification (VRA).