Life in a Darkonese city

[Igor the Henchman]

I was checking those mixed town populations in Darkon and it got me thinking: does it make sense, all these different races living in the same community? Can it actually be possible? Imagine living in a city where there's two or three "visible minorities" with three or even seven times your lifespan. Even with a wizard-king's firm hand, I don't see how those populations could live peacefully and quietly without occasional outbreaks of violence due to racism and distrust. I don't remember products that really deal with the issue. Does anyone have a theory to explain this?

[Tobias Blackburn]

Every domain reflects a world familiar to the darklord. Coming from Oerth, Azalin was used to towns with dwarves, elves and hoopy little fairies living side by side with humans. As a result, Darkon resembled this social order, and as far as the people were concerned, they had always lived next to one another.

Remember that Outcast Ratings in Darkon drop by two point due to the familiarity with these other races and the fact that they carry less "folklore" around them. That isn't to say that there isn't racial tension, just not much more than in other settings.

In the past, it would have been unthinkable to live side by side with people of other races or go to the same school with people of color. God willing, it isn't something that you would think about twice now.

Back to Ravenloft. Darkon fell apart without Azalin. Now that he's back, he's putting everything together again and there is no way he is going to put up with racial tensions. Everyone knows that the King is fair in his rulings, and won't be favorable in one way or the other, so the majority aren't going to complain. Those that do will find themselves on the end of sharp sticks.

[Drinnik Shoehorn]

I was checking those mixed town populations in Darkon and it got me thinking: does it make sense, all these different races living in the same community? Can it actually be possible? Imagine living in a city where there's two or three "visible minorities" with three or even seven times your lifespan. Even with a wizard-king's firm hand, I don't see how those populations could live peacefully and quietly without occasional outbreaks of violence due to racism and distrust. I don't remember products that really deal with the issue. Does anyone have a theory to explain this?

Remember that Darkon is more Cosmopolitan than other domains, the different races mix more than they do in, say Barovia, so they're more tolerant. Darkon is like a generic setting in that way, because that's what it was designed for. Darkon was supposed to be a hook for people because it had the most recognisable "D&D" landscape, if I remember what the writers have said over time.

[ScS of the Fraternity]

I would imagine that the various races are segregated within cities. Halflings and dwarves might be required by city ordinance to live in ghettos, forbidden to live or work outside of these walled in urban centers. Elves on the other hand might live in suburban quarters outside of cities.
There might be a system of sister cities as well. On one side of a river is the human city, while the other city is reserved for the nonhumans.

Of course, there's no reason for racial riots to not break out. In fact, the Kargat may even use these pogroms to help sustain their power. By instigating a riot every so often, the Kargat remind the demihumans that only Azalin's power keeps them safe. Should they plot to overthrow him, the human mob might not be dispersed.
As well, racism is a useful way for the lesser Darkonian nobles to distract the human masses from corruption and decay. When taxes go up, blame the shifty dwarves who swindle - when the roads fall apart, blame the lazy elves who think their too good to work on them.

[Jasper]

I think segrigation and racisum is very prevalant in those types of towns from both sides of the fence. Only by keeping all races in there own little cliques does it not fan out into a full scale war.

All non humans would be kept in ghetoes away from the main population (Ie: Little Qu'al thalas, New Thunderdelve) and are feft mostly to there own laws and traditions so long as they stay within the set boundraies. Any non-human must have a good reason to leave the ghetoe as they will face dirty looks and inflated prices. Direct confrontation is mosty taboo as far as the higher class is concerned and any visable acts will bring the wrath of the local authoraty. That however dosn't stop the local thugs from hurling insults from the shadows ("Hey rock f***er, go back to the mountains! Hey Leafeater wench, wana s***K on this log?)

Humans on the oher hand are welcome in the non-human sections with open is a little warry arms. The Non-humans weclome the humans gold and freely trade and haggle. The only trouble comes when a outsider human atempts to infiltrate non-human sociaty. Mixed marage is rarely allowed and only after long and involved rituals in effect transforming the human into the mates race.

Non-humans are mosty non existant in city politics with perhaps a token representive on the council. Any laws that are placed in effect limiting the rights of non-humans are met with at most murmered dissaproval as the non-humans dare not jeprodize thier possiotion in the humans city.

[Tobias Blackburn]

Humans on the oher hand are welcome in the non-human sections with open is a little warry arms. The Non-humans weclome the humans gold and freely trade and haggle. The only trouble comes when a outsider human atempts to infiltrate non-human sociaty. Mixed marage is rarely allowed and only after long and involved rituals in effect transforming the human into the mates race.

I don't know... if demihumans were hated each other that much, why would humans be exempt, especially if they're the ones making the laws about who lives in the ghettos? Why would they be treated better? Because there are more of them? If anything, I would think they would react just as angrily.

"Hey Quick-burn! Trying to shorten your life some more?"

"Get out of my space, Rabbit, and take your brothers and sisters with you."

[ScS of the Fraternity]

Oh, I like those taunts.

While humans would probably not get a warm reception from demihumans, remember that they are the majority and so, hold the power. Tick off the wrong human, and they'll come back with a mob. Most of the Darkonian nobles are human, most of the army, ect... thus the demihuman communities would have to be careful.

I suspect that humans would get extremly frosty treatment from demihuman. Idle blacksmiths would claim to be too busy to shod human-owned horses, poor woodcutters overcharge, shop owners close up just as the human sets foot on their porch, ect...
Of course, if a human appears powerful, then they get better treatment. After all, a powerful person might be quick to offend. If a human throws a bit of gold around he or she might be taken seriously.

In fact, this could lead to some neat advenure hooks. To commision a mithral dagger to combat a fiend, the players might need to ingratiate themselves to the local dwarves before they will even admit they have the mineral.

[Igor the Henchman]

Good theories all around, thought I'd mention that.

The racial isolation theory is one I find most reasonable, but still, I think it doesn't solve all the issues. Nor does the argument that Darkon is "just like a generic D&D realm". This may be nothing more than my own way to look at things, but even in generic D&D there's no way I'd accept cities with such mixed populations. Not without a pretty good explanation to go with it.

I'd isolate this comment, if I may:

While humans would probably not get a warm reception from demihumans, remember that they are the majority and so, hold the power.

This doesn't make sense so immediately to me as it does to Stephen. And not only because Darkon is a feudal monarchy where few dictate the laws for many. I'm thinking of one very important disruption factor - the most important of all. The one that causes the most problems logic-wise, in my view:

The difference in lifespans.

Humans live to be 90 years old at best
Dwarves and gnomes can hope to reach 350 years.
Elves live to be 700 years.

700 years! That means that the oldest elves are two centuries older than the whole damn demiplane! And Darkon was formed, when, three, four centuries ago? That would mean that the elves that live in Darkon today are the same ones that lived there when the domain emerged. They saw barons come and go. They saw the formation of the Kargat. They lived through the Crimson Death. Heck, some of them still remember being ruled by Darkalus Rex!

Now, how would any of these centuries-old elves possibly accept the authority of a 50-year old human baron? To him, he's barely an infant, a little fop.

Actually, if I were to rewrite Darkon's history in the most reasonable (for me) way, I'd deem it reasonable that elves would have to hold all of the main positions of power, not because they are the majority, but because they have seen more, have lots of experience and can outlive pretty much any non-elven competition. Why aren't all barons elves? If there was any inner tensions between the races, then by standard logic, it should be humans currently living in those ghettoes.

Why have the long-lived races not done any attempt to break free of human domination and found their own kingdoms? Why do they continue to live and support a regime where they have to follow orders of nobility magistrature and militia composed of people who, by their standards, are barely kids? How would they raise children under these conditions? "Daddy, why won't you let me go to the hunt? My buddy Larry goes all the time, and he's seen half the winters I have!"

This problem striked me only when I started to read those population statistics for Darkon towns. Without attempting to imply anything by this, I have to say there never seemed to have been a problem with this in 2e. In those days, Neblus was a city of elves, and Corvia a city of dwarves, and that was that. Martira Bay was the only "mixed" one of the lot, suggesting a more chaotic and open-minded population, which is consistent with the city's unique cosmopolitan air. With GazII, we now have populations something like "elves: 54%, humans 10%, dwarves 6%"

By the way, I'm not looking for advice on how to explain it in my campaign. I just want to know how its supposed to work in canon. Because I really don't see how it could. Anyone has more ideas to share?

[Jester of the FoS]

Elves strike me as too fighty and distracted to really deal with the day-to-day. When you have 300 years to do anything you hardly feel the urgency for small projects. They propably can't be bothered to even care about who's ruling the city this week (from their persepective) and just go about their lives. Sure they have years and centuries of wisdom but humans, with their short lifespans, have probably crammed more actual living in there.

Dwarves are hard-core lawful and honourable beings. They'd be respectful and polite to the man in charge regardless of species. They're good citizens who work hard and blend into the background.

Halflings possibly live in ghettos, but they're everywhere and tiny. Not the sot to raise trouble.

Gnomes... they're just gnomes...

[Manofevil]

Also as far as elves are concerned, there's a certain scene in 'Lord of the Necropolis' which might give a hint as to a common fate for those that might be older than the land. One of Azalin's few friends, Balitor if I recall right, has his life extended by Azalin when the Old Man literally sucks the life out of another baron who'd displeased him and channelled it into his friend. Elves, particularly ancients, have notoriously supremacist attitudes and as such, are bound to eventually rub the Old Man the wrong way and be made an example of. If there are any elves older than Azalin still around in Darkon, they must be very good at groveling, or at least at keeping their mouths shut.

[sabbattack]

I don't unserstand why anyone hasn't mentioned this yet. Maybe it is way too "deus ex machina", but couldn't the memory altering effect of Darkon create a peaceful background for humans and non/demihumans? After all Darkon is fantasy. Its scares don't lie in supersticion and racism and angry mobs with torches.

At least IMC Darkon scared the hell out of my players with its normality. People living "normal lives" next to demi-humans, non-humans, undead walking in the streets etc. The native players were scared by the non-humans themselves (But how can you chat with a halfling? Don't you know they steal babies from their cradles??) and the outsiders were scared by the oblivion of the Darkonese to the Kargat. One other thing they liked in particular was the fact that I changed the memory altering to a more gradual "realization" of its effect. Thus I gave the players a certain "warning" hint while at the same time messed with their heads with deja-vu from the most crazy places and people.

[Tobias Blackburn]

I don't understand why racial tensions would be that visible, or especially expressed in the laws of the land. Azalin doesn't strike me as a racist figure. He hates everyone equally, and that's all the reason you need to keep racial tensions down to a dull roar.

When Azalin took power some two hundred yearas ago, the first thing he would have done is cleanse the system of incompetence and set up the laws. While a harsh dictator, he is loved by the people, because the laws are simple and fairly reasonable. He would have looked at the groups that made up Darkon and asked what they had to offer society. He wouldn't care that elves live for a thousand years or that dwarves are usually good. If he could see that the group had something to offer to make Darkon strong, he would have given them full rights. This is probably what lead to settlements with racial majorities that are strong and prosperous. If you want to keep a group down, you don't ever allow them to gain a foothold like Nuchelvar Springs or Corvia, you confine them to places like ghettos.

Some might of objected to having to treat elves like humans (or vice versa), but that is what the Kargat is for. After a few years of people disappearing for they act on blatently racist urges, the enitre country would have learned to play nice. While it might be creepy being with near an elf that bought things from your great-grandfather when he opened the store, he is a paying customer and its better to smile than risk having the Kargat take an interest in you.

During Azalin's hiatus, Darkon fell apart. While athis was due to the loss of his strong rule, one of the effects could have been a rush of the old racial hatred spurting back to the surface, especially with little to keep it in check. Martia Bay's kargat probably watch their lot, but that was likely an oddity where the power in charge cared about what was going on.

When Azalin returned, he started to set things right again. While there might still be problems for your players to deal with, such as race riots and insults, they shouldn't taint their every moment in Darkon. Azalin needs Darkon to be strong again and won't let the people let little things like prejudice get in his way. His resources are much more limited, but most people who remember the peace of his previous reign and the chaos of the Necropolis years will realize that such actions won't be tolerated and are, in the end, for the best.

If an entire family had spent 5 generations being warned to treat the short guys like you would any other stranger, those lessons would probably overtake any fear or loathing. They see them every day, hear about them every day, and know that their King is capable of and more than willing to pound square pegs into round holes. In that environment, fear does a great job of quelling any prejudice you might feel, and after a few generations it isn't as necessary. The longer living races probably learned the new social order quicker because they had more to lose by 'disappearing' than humans did, and they were treated better too.

As for Darkon being "generic fantasy", it resmembles that because it was what Azalin came from. If you can explain why elves, humans and dwarves can live peacefully in Waterdeep, the answer is valid in Darkon (doubly so because its what Azalin wants). Darkon resembles Oerth, where you do have the races living together in harmony, just as every other domain reflects something familiar to the Darklord. In this case, being generic fantasy isn't the excuse, its a reason. Add to it the fact that Azalin is too effecient a ruler to allow open hatred between groups and you have all the reason you need to keep the players with having to spend every single session dealing with racial issues.

[cure]

I think a hint to the Darkonian attitude is to be found by considering the neighbour, mainly the racist impaler on the southern frontier who keeps launching massively wasteful and utterly hopeless invasions. Darkonians undoubtably consider themselves and their king to be far more intelligent and civilized, and a general lack of racism is a key part of their superiority.

A related point concerns the loyalty of any demi-human race anywhere near Drakov. Demi-human races have the most reason of anyone to take the field of battle in the defense of Darkon. Hence an excellent reputation.

Finally, in Azalin's absence, not a few of the regional leaders who emerged where demi-human. It is humans that are in the minority in not a few places in Darkon which implies a tacit acceptance of political equality. Each, regardless of race, is a Darkonian citizen. Ultimately, Darkon is a monarchy with a king who considers everyone else to be equally beneath him. Azalin associates with humans, dwarven vampires, shadow dragons precisely to the degree that each individual is useful to him. Heck, Azalin might not even be gender biased.

[cure]

Azalin is unchallenged to such a degree that he has no need whatsoever to divide to hold on to power.

So why not imagine that individuals stirring up racial problems are immediately labelled agents of Drakov and hunted down ruthlessly to their last by the Kargat?

No, everyone may not love everyone else. But Azalin will be damned before he loses to race riots in Martira Bay resources and time better spent plotting his escape from the Demi-plane. So people do not bother their neighbours lest the dead come for them in the night.

Of course this leaves unanswered the degree to which there is social intergration . ..

[Igor the Henchman]

On the subject of racist tendenceis: reading GazII didn't really make me feel as though there are serious racial tensions or racist labels going on in Darkon. Nor would most of the citizens dream of challenging Azalin and his laws. Given the domain's background, and especially the memory-drain feature, the races don't really hate each other, I would think. S would have noticed something like that. Granted, we are speaking of Ravenloft, so maybe it wasn't mentioned because racial prejudice is considered a most normal and default state of things.