Gazetteer Metaplot

[Moral Machivelli]

I meant crumble figuretively, The domain would still exist but it would be very vurnerable. S explaines it in Borca's epilouge in Gaz 4

[Lucius]

Concerning the metaplot, I think we must work over the facts.

* In RL 3e page 108. Azalin says in his notes : "I now know that there are mysteries in this world that even my toermentor do not understand."
My undertanding is that these mysteries are the 13 children o fthe GC. So, what Azalin seeks is for the children.

*Another topic is: Why is Azalin searching for the children of the GC?

In the Ravenloft Gazetteer III, page 7, S says "I suspect that my patron has me scouring the land to uncover ocult means of release from the mystic bounds of his lordship", and Azalin says " Release? Perhaps, little scholar, perhaps. Yet not in the manner oyu suspect."

Reading again the page 108 of RL 3e "I will throw off their shakles. I will have Irik back. I will teach my tormentor to fear"

For me Azalin wants to use the the powers of the children of the GC not to escape the demiplane, but to release himself (and the pther darklords) from his curse and from the limitation of leaving his domain. Without his currse he will be able to ressurrect Irik.

And with the darklords released from their domains, and without their curses the demiplane will loose his purpose, what will be terrible for the Dark Powers. How will the DPs control the darklrods it they aren´t tied to the domains and don´t have tueir curses anymore? "I will teach my tormentors to fear".

How will new domains be created if there are no curses anymore and the darklords are not tied to a single place?

* The bracer: Gazetteer 5, page 5, the TRbie of Hyskosa says to S "Tell this to your master when you join him in the grave..." I think this is related to what would happen in Blaustein. Maybe S dies (or faces some terrible situation) ,and thanks to her bracer she can be contacted by Azalin. Or the braces activates in some specific place ("the grave").

Still talking about the ToH words, "That wich is hidden must not be found;" I think it is a reference for the children of the Gc.
And "That which is chained must remain bound", I think is a reference to Azalin intentions of releasing the darklords.

[Sorti]

About working over the facts, the GC has chosen only Vistani brides for his children, so we can suppose it has something to do with the Vistani connection to the land. Any good idea about what the GC plan is? (well, I said "about facts", but here i accept conjectures as well )

[alhoon]

Couldn't the reality wrinkle of a Dukar who "the Dark Powers themselves have difficulty perceiving" stop the dark powers reading Azalin's mind?

I really don't think so. The Powers of the Dukkar and the reality wrinkles and everything in the Demiplane is coming from the Dark powers themselves. The Dark Powers haven't any difficulty perceiving the Dukar, they make him so. If the DP wanted, Malocchio could be turned instantly and irrevocably to a common deer. No sight, no Reality wrinkle, no sentience at all.
Only divine intervention (not wish, not miracle) by a Divine Rank 6+ god would restore him.

[Drinnik Shoehorn]

Couldn't the reality wrinkle of a Dukar who "the Dark Powers themselves have difficulty perceiving" stop the dark powers reading Azalin's mind?

I really don't think so. The Powers of the Dukkar and the reality wrinkles and everything in the Demiplane is coming from the Dark powers themselves. The Dark Powers haven't any difficulty perceiving the Dukar, they make him so. If the DP wanted, Malocchio could be turned instantly and irrevocably to a common deer. No sight, no Reality wrinkle, no sentience at all.
Only divine intervention (not wish, not miracle) by a Divine Rank 6+ god would restore him.

Al, a direct quote from the Gaz IV reads:

It may even be that the Dark Powers themselves have difficulty perciving him.

[alhoon]

So?

What makes you think that S is right?

[Drinnik Shoehorn]

So?

What makes you think that S is right?

It's not a quote from S.

It's a quote from Malocchio's character writeup in the DM's section.

[alhoon]

Yes, but it is said as a theory of S and the rest studying Malocchio. At least that's my opinion.

After all, it is like you making a simple computer program. Nothing terrible, just a few lines.

What are the chances after you test & correct it that the program may do something that defies you and your wishes? And also something that you cannot fix?

PS And what are the chances that the program can kill you?

[Ail]

I'd just like to point you to R3E introduction to chapter 4. I guess it says a lot if we can read it (and that reminds me of Mangrum's message a few posts up "In my own defense, Azalin spells out my interpretation in R3E."

The crucial part seems to be:
"I do not yet comprehend what I have learned ... But it is enough simply to know that these mysteries exist and that they confound my captors.
The solution may require years of labor [the writing of the gazzetteers at least] ; it may require decades. ... My tormentors may rob me of my freedom and my magic, but they cannot steal my defiance, nor can they reduce my endless supply of time.
My tormentors will never let me go free [recall what Mangrum said, he knows he can't escape. If Ryan says his plan involves some escape attempt, it is not Azalin's escape. Or at least, not from RL. He may view freedom in the Core but not in Darkon as still imprisonment] ... I will teach my tormentors they are not the masters of my fate.
I will throw off their shackles [meaning, I will be free from Darkon, possibly, or I will learn new magic, more likely]. I will have Irik back. I will teach my tormentors to fear

and this seems clearly to me an attitude against the DP, perhaps because he understood a way of turning the DP useless. If all that keeps them alive is the trapped Darklords, if they ignore their curses of their prisons the DP will be useless.

Now, the Gazetteers are a way to understand what mysteries are those that confound the DP and to understand them before the DP do. His main objective is to void his curse and make some war on the DP, to question their power to make them unsure.

Also, Mangrum has said something once that the Gaz series was to end in Bluetspur. The way he said it made me think that that fact was crucial. So, what of so big importance could exist there to culminate the whole plot? Is the God-Brain somehow involved? Will Azalin be able to gain his enormous knowledge?

Just my humble contribution.

Ail

[Funk]

Should probably start a new thread with direct quotes and page numbers to references in the Gazetteer - a page of facts, and leave our "guesses" to another thread - seperate what's fact, and what's construed from those facts.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Al, a direct quote from the Gaz IV reads:

It may even be that the Dark Powers themselves have difficulty perciving him.

Which means that, a la "canon", it's not certain if they can perceive his thoughts or not. "May even be" is hardly definitive ... which puts the ball back in the individual DM's court. What's really important here is not whether or not the DPs can perceive Malocchio, but whether Azalin thinks they can't. Remember, for all we know, Azalin's belief that he'd percieved the DPs' true thoughts, while in his disembodied state, may itself be a load of hooey that they spoon-fed him, to send him off on yet another wild-goose chase.

Darn it, this is as frustrating as trying to figure out what's really going on, when I'm watching "Lost"! No source of information is immune from suspicion and doubt....

[alhoon]

What's really important here is not whether or not the DPs can perceive Malocchio, but whether Azalin thinks they can't. Remember, for all we know, Azalin's belief that he'd percieved the DPs' true thoughts, while in his disembodied state, may itself be a load of hooey that they spoon-fed him, to send him off on yet another wild-goose chase.

IMO that's the case. The DP create patterns as if they don't have control over them, make Azalin try to exploit them and sit there watching him fail and laugh at his expense. Like: "Look what the punny little lich thought: That we can't perceive Malocchio! ! ! BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA!"

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Yep. FWIW, unless I think of a good reason to reverse this interpretation, IMC Azalin was really hearing his own hypotheses reflected back at him, not the DPs' true motivations. Although I'm not sure they were doing it to him for chuckles ... more like routine business-as-usual, to keep their lich busy chewing the bars of his cage for another fifty years or so.

Personally, I'm rather taken with the idea that the DPs' true motivations are something to which Mr. "I'm-their-favorite-toy" Azalin is peripheral at best. Wouldn't that be the ultimate ironic put-down for his ego, to learn that he's not even a full-fledged pawn in their real game, but just some random schmuck who stumbled onto the playing-field and whom they're simply keeping out of the way...?

[alhoon]

That's harsh . . . I don't know if I personally like it, although I agree that it has some appeal. Azalin would get stunned if he discovered that after 250 years he didn't even get their attention.

Think of this: The Time of Unparalel darkness comes and it is simple: The Darklords meet the Dark Powers avatars in person.

(walking into the meeting angry) Hey! I demand explanations and . . .
DP1: Who the hell are you?
(shouting) I'm Azalin Rex!
DP1: Azalin who?
DP2: (ignoring Azalin) I think he is the Lich we have trapped into the core.
DP1: Hmm. Perhaps what was his domain?
DP3: I think it is Darkon, but I'm not sure the Darklord there was named Azalin, the book here says something about a lich Firan.
DP2: Perhaps it has been a mistake in the procedure, this angry fellow may not be a darklord at all.
DP2(turning to Azalin): May your name be Firan instead of Azalin? Because if not, then you're wasting our time. Markov, our favorite boy is waiting!
DP3: (ignoring Azalin again) Hey I found a foot note. Azalin is the name he is known in Darkon and yes, he is a darklord.
DP2: Hmmm. What's his curse DP3?
DP3: (in shame) I don't remember.
DP1: Me either. . . Look at the book again DP3.

[ScS of the Fraternity]

Awsome, alhoon. Simply awsome.