Ravenloft Reanimated: Darklords and Domains
- WolfKook
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Ravenloft Reanimated: Darklords and Domains
Well, after one week of voting and with 33 votes and about 78% of them voting for a Ravenloft Reanimated (Though still with a disagreement about the approach that should be taken that is less definitive than the global vote), I guess we could go on with the design decisions.
Independently of the decision, there is a couple of elements that are really fundamental to the concept of Ravenloft, to the point that the setting would not exist as it does without them: We're talking about darklords -evil, tortured beings which reign supreme, but are at the same time prisoner of their realms -and their domains -patches of land which reflect their darklords in almost every way -.
The time has come to decide which domains & darklords should be included/excluded from Ravenloft Reanimated, and the first step in this is to choose among those which belong to the original/current setting (Including fan-made domains and darklords, if any, to be consistent with our design goals).
We're not talking about retconning any one of them, or placing them on the Core/Clusters/Islands yet, we are just looking for the characters and realms that really define what Ravenloft is, or should be. We're not even asking for domain/darklord couples... Perhaps there's one domain that is very rich and interesting, but its darklord isn't so great, or vice versa (An interesting darklord with a clunky domain).
So, the question is, which of the existing domains/darklords will you include/exclude if you were making a complete remake of Ravenloft?
(Make a list of up to 10 domains and 10 darklords to include, and up to 5 domains and 5 darklords to exclude. Each vote for inclusion grants 1 point to the domain/darklord, and each vote for exclusion substracts 1. Those with a positive amount after one month will be included).
Independently of the decision, there is a couple of elements that are really fundamental to the concept of Ravenloft, to the point that the setting would not exist as it does without them: We're talking about darklords -evil, tortured beings which reign supreme, but are at the same time prisoner of their realms -and their domains -patches of land which reflect their darklords in almost every way -.
The time has come to decide which domains & darklords should be included/excluded from Ravenloft Reanimated, and the first step in this is to choose among those which belong to the original/current setting (Including fan-made domains and darklords, if any, to be consistent with our design goals).
We're not talking about retconning any one of them, or placing them on the Core/Clusters/Islands yet, we are just looking for the characters and realms that really define what Ravenloft is, or should be. We're not even asking for domain/darklord couples... Perhaps there's one domain that is very rich and interesting, but its darklord isn't so great, or vice versa (An interesting darklord with a clunky domain).
So, the question is, which of the existing domains/darklords will you include/exclude if you were making a complete remake of Ravenloft?
(Make a list of up to 10 domains and 10 darklords to include, and up to 5 domains and 5 darklords to exclude. Each vote for inclusion grants 1 point to the domain/darklord, and each vote for exclusion substracts 1. Those with a positive amount after one month will be included).
"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom"
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- WolfKook
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Well, it's more difficult than I had expected, but here's my list:
INCLUDE
Barovia/Strahd
Darkon/Azalin
Fairhaven (QtR15)/Queen Avarein (As expected)
Har'Akir/Ankhtepot
Lamordia/Dr. Victor Mordenheim
Sri Raji/Arijani
Arkandale (Lonesome Road version)
Mictlan (BoSor)
Mordent
Souragne
Elena Faithhold
Lord Soth
Raffaele Feudale (Of Monte Mal)
Vlad Drakov
EXCLUDE
Hazlan/Hazlik
Keening/Tristessa
Vechor/Easan
Necropolis
Verbrek
Inza Kulchevich
Lord Wilfred Godefroy
INCLUDE
Barovia/Strahd
Darkon/Azalin
Fairhaven (QtR15)/Queen Avarein (As expected)
Har'Akir/Ankhtepot
Lamordia/Dr. Victor Mordenheim
Sri Raji/Arijani
Arkandale (Lonesome Road version)
Mictlan (BoSor)
Mordent
Souragne
Elena Faithhold
Lord Soth
Raffaele Feudale (Of Monte Mal)
Vlad Drakov
EXCLUDE
Hazlan/Hazlik
Keening/Tristessa
Vechor/Easan
Necropolis
Verbrek
Inza Kulchevich
Lord Wilfred Godefroy
"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom"
William Blake
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Ow. This is a lot harder than you'd think...
Well, here are my votes. We can get into whys and wherefores in a little bit.
KEEP:
Barovia/Strahd
Darkon/Azalin
Lamordia/Dr. Victor Mordenheim
Vlad Drakov/Falkovina
Verbek/Alfred Timothy
Mordentshire/Lord Wilfred Godefroy
Tepest/Three Sisters
Bleutspur/Unknown
Invidia/Gabrielle Aderre (who desperately needs a rewrite...)
Borca/Irina Boritsi
EXCLUDE
Sithicus/Lord Soth
Hazlan/Hazlik
Well, here are my votes. We can get into whys and wherefores in a little bit.
KEEP:
Barovia/Strahd
Darkon/Azalin
Lamordia/Dr. Victor Mordenheim
Vlad Drakov/Falkovina
Verbek/Alfred Timothy
Mordentshire/Lord Wilfred Godefroy
Tepest/Three Sisters
Bleutspur/Unknown
Invidia/Gabrielle Aderre (who desperately needs a rewrite...)
Borca/Irina Boritsi
EXCLUDE
Sithicus/Lord Soth
Hazlan/Hazlik
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My votes for preservation
Darklords and Domains
Strahd - Barovia
Azalin Rex - Darkon
Mordenheim/Adam - Lamordia
Ivan Dilisnya/Ivana Boritsi - Borca
Ankhtepot - Har'Akir
Morgoth - The Nocturnal Sea
Domains
Mordent
Pharazia
Darklords
Harkon Lukas
Malken
Exclude
Tristessa - Keening
Tristan - Forlorn
von Kharkov - Valachan
Renier - Richemulot
Inza Kulchevich
Invidia
Darklords and Domains
Strahd - Barovia
Azalin Rex - Darkon
Mordenheim/Adam - Lamordia
Ivan Dilisnya/Ivana Boritsi - Borca
Ankhtepot - Har'Akir
Morgoth - The Nocturnal Sea
Domains
Mordent
Pharazia
Darklords
Harkon Lukas
Malken
Exclude
Tristessa - Keening
Tristan - Forlorn
von Kharkov - Valachan
Renier - Richemulot
Inza Kulchevich
Invidia
Difficult indeed......after a while I come up with the following
KEEP The Core domains
with the exception of:
- Sithicus - Lord Soth (or just let it be history)
- Invidia
Major makeover:
- Nova Vaasa and it's Darklord
Ok, the pockets/islands now:
**EDIT, added 26-11-08**
KEEP (without change)
- Souragne
- Sri'Raji
- Har'Akir
KEEP (with change or more info)
- Odiaire (I can't help it, I love the concept and 50 yrs after it's creation it can get a complete overhaul and maybe even incorporated in the Core. Lord of the Flies jumps to mind )
- Frozen Reaches
- Rokujima Taiyoo (was just a post about that I saw)
I think it's important to include variety of gameplay in the makeover. Offer different cultures and climates instead of "mostly European based" domains. Gothic Horror exists everywhere in some form...
KEEP The Core domains
with the exception of:
- Sithicus - Lord Soth (or just let it be history)
- Invidia
Major makeover:
- Nova Vaasa and it's Darklord
Ok, the pockets/islands now:
**EDIT, added 26-11-08**
KEEP (without change)
- Souragne
- Sri'Raji
- Har'Akir
KEEP (with change or more info)
- Odiaire (I can't help it, I love the concept and 50 yrs after it's creation it can get a complete overhaul and maybe even incorporated in the Core. Lord of the Flies jumps to mind )
- Frozen Reaches
- Rokujima Taiyoo (was just a post about that I saw)
I think it's important to include variety of gameplay in the makeover. Offer different cultures and climates instead of "mostly European based" domains. Gothic Horror exists everywhere in some form...
Last edited by Guzrath on Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Survivors will be shot again.
Survivors will be shot again.
- Paladyn
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I'd like to point one thing: some domains should not be treated as realms or countries. For example in my campaign Verbrek was not different country but was called Verbrek Forest and no other realm was willing to claim it. That same thing is with Keening, I'd propose making it part of Darkon.
As for Darklords... I'd kick out Valachan, Lord Soth (he's Dragonlance property and Inza is far more interesting) and totally redesign Nova Vassa.
As for Darklords... I'd kick out Valachan, Lord Soth (he's Dragonlance property and Inza is far more interesting) and totally redesign Nova Vassa.
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- WolfKook
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Sure! After we decide on domains and darklords, there'll probably be a process of "X kills Y and takes his stuff" (i.e. "Darkon kills Keening and takes its stuff"), ala what happen with D&D 3E to 4E , with selected domains getting the opportunity to absorb those with smaller scores.Paladyn wrote:I'd like to point one thing: some domains should not be treated as realms or countries. For example in my campaign Verbrek was not different country but was called Verbrek Forest and no other realm was willing to claim it. That same thing is with Keening, I'd propose making it part of Darkon.
For now, it would seem that Barovia, Darkon, Lamordia, Mordent and probably Borca will have the opportunity to choose first.
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William Blake
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Not to drag us off topic too much, but at least part of my criterea are filling the archetypes: The Vampire. The Ghost. The Monster. The Werewolf. You know, all the Universal Studios classics.
Sometimes the actual Darklord doesn't fill the role correctly, but you want the domain around. I'm not thrilled with Alfred Timothy, but I sure want Verbek - aka the Wolfwood - around in some incarnation.
I've used Azalin as a sort of Anti-Merlin in the past; while Soth needs to go, I can see a tragic-chivalric kingdom with a Black Knight in it as a part of the mix. Just not Soth, as cool as he is.
Sometimes the actual Darklord doesn't fill the role correctly, but you want the domain around. I'm not thrilled with Alfred Timothy, but I sure want Verbek - aka the Wolfwood - around in some incarnation.
I've used Azalin as a sort of Anti-Merlin in the past; while Soth needs to go, I can see a tragic-chivalric kingdom with a Black Knight in it as a part of the mix. Just not Soth, as cool as he is.
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I definitely agree. The final idea is to fill those slots, first by looting from what already exists (Thus the voting), then by creating new material to fill those that continue open after that.Irving the Meek wrote:Not to drag us off topic too much, but at least part of my criterea are filling the archetypes: The Vampire. The Ghost. The Monster. The Werewolf. You know, all the Universal Studios classics.
BTW, Should I interpret your votes as counting for Azalin and Verbrek, and against Alfred Timothy and Lord Soth?
By now, the most voted domains continue being Barovia, Darkon, Lamordia and Mordent, while Keening and Sithicus don't seem as they will be able to make it. Perhaps Keening will be absorbed by Darkon, and Sithicus gets an elven darklord, as DocBeard suggests? Hope you guys continue voting, and please don't forget all those fan-made domains and darklords out there.
"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom"
William Blake
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I'm not especially thrilled with Sithicus in its current incarnation. Soth definitely has to go. Not that I hate him by any stretch, but he's just not our toy to play with. Timothy... I need a better take on him than what I've seen. I'd much, much rather have a werewolf of Godzilla-like combat heinousness. But that's for another thread.WolfKook wrote: BTW, Should I interpret your votes as counting for Azalin and Verbrek, and against Alfred Timothy and Lord Soth?
So, to refine: Yes on Azalin, yes on Verbek. No on Timothy, no on Soth. Thank you most sincerely for reading my mind correctly.
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Does it require a madness check?Irving the Meek wrote:Thank you most sincerely for reading my mind correctly.
Yes on Azalin, yes on Verbrek, yes on Sithicus but without Soth. I'd put Afred against Nathan in some way.
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I only wish. Trust me, it's a *real* short read.Paladyn wrote: Does it require a madness check?
So after talking with my favorite Ravenloft player and my loving wife (easy conversation, since they're the same person), she'd like to put a few votes in.
Remove:
Keening
Malken (but not Nova Vaasa)
Timothy (but not Verbek)
Nathan (lose father and son while you're at it)
Godefroy (but keep Mordentshire)
Keep:
Richelmont/Jaqueline Renier
Azalin/Darkon
Tepest/ The Three Sisters
Valachan (The Baron is really intriguing, but badly needs a rewrite)
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I don't know that excluding domains or dark lords is the way to approach this. I can see the core as a living tapestry of torment, reaching out and replicating lands like a giant lump of silly putty. Like silly putty, it is easily warped into suitable prisons for these beings after their act of perdition.
As we get the back story and geographical placement figured out, rewriting where necessary, any of these domains can and should be included. We still have the option of severing a domain into a cluster if it does not make a desirable fit with the core. This allows for such domains to be used by those that want to use them and ignored by those that don't (I'm looking at you Lord Soth).
I would like to specifically see the Nightmare lands included. There is just so many opportunities to truly make the horror that Ravenloft should entail more personal...
As we get the back story and geographical placement figured out, rewriting where necessary, any of these domains can and should be included. We still have the option of severing a domain into a cluster if it does not make a desirable fit with the core. This allows for such domains to be used by those that want to use them and ignored by those that don't (I'm looking at you Lord Soth).
I would like to specifically see the Nightmare lands included. There is just so many opportunities to truly make the horror that Ravenloft should entail more personal...
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- WolfKook
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I see your point, but this will be (And has always been) the individual DM's prerrogative. All previous incarnations of RL have included a list of "official" domains and darklords which are fully supported, leaving all other domains to the dim of the DM.Gnarfflinger wrote:I don't know that excluding domains or dark lords is the way to approach this. I can see the core as a living tapestry of torment, reaching out and replicating lands like a giant lump of silly putty. Like silly putty, it is easily warped into suitable prisons for these beings after their act of perdition.
As we get the back story and geographical placement figured out, rewriting where necessary, any of these domains can and should be included. We still have the option of severing a domain into a cluster if it does not make a desirable fit with the core. This allows for such domains to be used by those that want to use them and ignored by those that don't (I'm looking at you Lord Soth).
The question is, then, which domains do you want to get full support from this project, and which ones you don't like that much and would prefer to see this project's efforts directed elsewhere, keeping in mind that we have just enough time for a fixed set of domains and darklords, especially if we want to get this done in the near future.
"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom"
William Blake
William Blake