Café de Nuit

Personally, I prefer the Reality Wrinkle option, it makes more sense for a character that has lasted so long and remained so pure

Well, I like the NPCs quite much (Kattinker Tatters was very successful NPC in my campaign), and I also like very much the scholar and true innocent classes. The artwork is very nice and the feats two, while the organisation of Ezra is useful (and its prestige classes too). This book is particularly good if you play CL8 or CL9 campaigns. The rest of the book has some nice ideas (I like the romance section for example) but isn't extremely useful.

If your PC's use the last stand ability, so what. They beat the darklord. Big deal. Their is always somebody just as evil and mabey even moreso in a domain.(not counting the domains where the daklord is the only inhabitant.) Gabrialle dies, Malachio rises. Drakov falls, Ludzig comes out of his feeding houses. Dominic is replaced by the Brain.

Yes, of course, thats true. No one is arguing that a character with the ability Last Stand is going to turn the Demiplane of Dread into Disneyland.

The thing about which I am complaining is the fact that a mortal character has the ability to boss a darklord around and force them to act in a manner in which they might never behave.

ScS of the Fraternity wrote: The thing about which I am complaining is the fact that a mortal character has the ability to boss a darklord around and force them to act in a manner in which they might never behave.

Well, a level 14 character (about the darklords' average) who has remained blessed for soooo long is as special as any darklord, IMO. It's any DM's duty to test his morality often, and very few characters would survive that with their morality intact.
By the way, let's say he reaches that level of power. And, without research, just believes that the darklord of Invidia is Malocchio. He uses his power and Gabrielle comes. "Ok" he says "it's a different darklord, so what? I'll kill her"
And then, Malocchio is the darklord. A choice which will probably create more suffering for the domain. I would call a powers check immediately should anything like this happens - the character ought to have researched the consequences of his actions. And so... no more blessed, no more last stand!

tec-goblin wrote:By the way, let's say he reaches that level of power. And, without research, just believes that the darklord of Invidia is Malocchio. He uses his power and Gabrielle comes. "Ok" he says "it's a different darklord, so what? I'll kill her"

If Gabby was in that situation in my games I would have her charm the Paladin

And then, Malocchio is the darklord. A choice which will probably create more suffering for the domain. I would call a powers check immediately should anything like this happens - the character ought to have researched the consequences of his actions. And so... no more blessed, no more last stand!

I would call ror a Powers check also, the Paladin has - whether he wanted to or not - subjected a land to a far worse fate than it already had. Even though he meant well, his own decision to kill Gabby has plunged Invidia into despair.

Of course, since the Dukkar forms a little blind spot, we don'r know if he can become a dark lord or not. Would be interesting to find out though.

If Malocchio did become a Dark Lord, I wonder what his curse would be? Would be a little weak to have it he same as what his mother had.

Would killing a dark lord draw a powers check?

I know that in the D&D cosmology, that killing a fiend (evil outsider) is never an evil act, no matter what the circumstances. I also know that the dark lords of Ravenloft is more or less the equivalent of fiendish accomplishment. I don't think the paladin would have to make a powers check, unless he killed Gabrielle to knowingly make Malochhio the Dark Lord of Invidia.

If the paladin mentioned killed Gabby just because she turned up when he called for the dark lord to him she may not be evil since he imagined Malocchio turning up. Yes Gabby has a checkered past to those who know it, but to the people of Invidia she is by far more preferable to them than Malocchio would ever be. Putting a tyrant like Malocchio, who would butcher his people if he wanted to, in complete power would be an evil act, even if killing a dark lord resulted in it

So I would call for a powwers check in those conditions.

I got it! Malachio's darklord curse is that he will never be able to get rid of the Vistani. In fact, the Vistani birthrate in Invida increases dramaticaly every year.

Only problem with that curse is that the vistani shun Invidia due to the presence of the Dukkar there (plus they are not welcome by anyone there really), so your curse may not work.

Gabby can't harm the vistani herself, so that would be a bit of a rip off to give to Malocchio as well. It would have to be a good curse though, it is for the Dukkar after all

Increased vistani birth rates is a good idea, perhaps working along those lines would reach an effective cirse for him.... How about that whenever a vistana is harmed on his command a vistani woman conceives a child? That way he can never be rid of the race.

Last Stand isn't too bad, from the sounds of it. For one, any paladin high enough level to take it would already be attracting the darklord's attention. For two, most darklords can't be permanently killed anyway. Strahd has a contingency spell teleport him to a hollow but enclosed space in a mountain so he can heal. Harkon Lukas' spirit possesses the nearest wolf in his domain. Hazlik's soul transfers to a gem that compels the first person who sees it to wear it, eventually transforming that person into Hazlik. Malken's curse transfers to the next male in the Hiregaard line. Azalin's soul transfers to his phylactery and/or any nearby corpse. Adam's body regenerates from the smallest scrap unless Dr. Mordenheim is killed at the exact same time. And so on.

Like ScS said, Last Stand didn't bother me because I thought the paladin would go from Domain to Domain killing darklords and dissolving domains. It bothered me because it breaks the tenets of the setting. No mortal magic should be able to cross the dark powers, including bossing around their playthings. I can't picture the dark powers allowing it.

No mortal magic should be able to cross the dark powers, including bossing around their playthings. I can't picture the dark powers allowing it.

I don't know...
Mabey they get bored with their playthings?
Mabey they see a bigger, more colorful toy in the store?[/quote]

gonzoron wrote:It bothered me because it breaks the tenets of the setting. No mortal magic should be able to cross the dark powers, including bossing around their playthings. I can't picture the dark powers allowing it.

Forgive the interjection of someone who doesn't own the book, but IMHO this sounds like an extension of something the DP's have allowed from the beginning--the DL's sense of paladins in their domains.

Last Stand simply escalates the "mental itch" to catastrophic levels, where the DL is forced to take action.

And then, Malocchio is the darklord. A choice which will probably create more suffering for the domain. I would call a powers check immediately should anything like this happens - the character ought to have researched the consequences of his actions. And so... no more blessed, no more last stand!

What kind of research would tell the PC:
--That Mallochio will become the next DL? It's not set in stone. As yet, Mallochio's reality wrinkle would prevent him from becoming a DL. Barring him, there might be someone else who's earned it (Matton?) or the surrounding domains may simply annex Invidia.
--That Invidia will suffer more with Mallochio as DL? He'll gain a curse, and since the paladin doesn't know at the outset what the curse will be, how can he be so sure that Mallochio's reign of terror will even continue? Even assuming that it does, how does the paladin--or anyone for that matter--know that things will be worse?

Let's look at one hypothetical fallout from Gabby's demise:
The resistance against Mallochio loses its figurehead, but a distraught Matton manages to stir up even more support against Mallochio by casting Gabby as a martyr. The resistance fighters move into Barovia because a more powerful Mallochio is better able to track them down. The more powerful Mallochio also draws the attention of Borca and the rest of the League of Four, who begin supporting the resistance movement to undermine him. I see a lot of potential for good there, as well as for evil.

If you are going to expect a high-level paladin to account for the long-range effects of all his actions, he won't be able to do anything. If a Vistani told you that one of the people you were about to rescue would one day build a golem, would you not rescue the person, or turn your back? Which alternative would you demand a powers check for?